Knowing how to use what youve got is better than wishing that it was something else. Could I make do with a DA/SA gun? As every police department in the nation, the vast majority of our students and now the US military have figured out, de-cocker style operating systems suck. AND, you dont really know how good you COULD be. Thats entirely false. Weve got the appeal to authority fallacy. I love my 1911. Look, all systems have compromises. Have one pistol with a decocker, not my carry weapon. Speaking of needless safety and training issues, should we discuss the need to pull the trigger on striker fired gun before disassembly? A lightweight firing pin, and/or heavier firing pin spring, make the 1911 inherently drop safe. When youre ready to fire it has no extra steps compared to any other pistol with a manual safety. The Walther decocker (PP, P-38) actually lock the firing pin in position as the safety/decocker iso engaged. Both the 1911 and Hi Power use the single action/double action, cocked and locked style mechanism. It was the cats meow compared to my S&W M66 (which I loved, and still do!). This is generally deemed less safe because (A) it requires slow and awkward cocking of that rear-mounted hammer, a task perhaps better suited to an orangutans paw than the human thumb, and (B) it requires pulling the trigger of a loaded gun to safely lower the hammer, which can easily result in a slip and an unintended discharge. Having a father-in-law like you would be the next best thing. Use a utility brush, lubricant, cleaning patch, and dry cloth to clean the slide, frame, and chamber. I can carry it either cocked and locked, OR as a DA by thumbing down the hammer. You DO realize THAT Taurus was on the recall list Geoff? I too have moved on to CZs. Quick check for safety, work the hammer with finger outside the guard, no cock, safety is on. It wasnt until a century later that the concept of training like Jerry Miculek so you can make 400 yard shots with a J-frame in DA with the pist ol held upside down and using your pinky finger on the trigger became a thing. TDA guns are designed to be safer carry guns. The current standard issue and substitute standard pistols of the U.S. armed forces are double-actions with decockers, and they have long been popular with civilian users as well. I think the authors theory that de-cockers were developed to get around patents is absurd. De-cocker equipped pistols (generally) have an exposed hammer. Always point a gun in a safe direction. Were still waiting for official confirmation that a Glock will replace the SIGs currently in-use by the SEAL teams (A rumor to that effect popped up last year). Except many of them, Glocks etc, are carried cocked and unlocked, since there is no safety. Best know your firearm before you need it. Could I make do with a DA/SA gun? If people like them, goody for them because it means absolutely nothing to me. . If its hammer was as easy to thumb as my Python, it would have been perfect. My Taurus 24/7 Pro LS DS 9mm. Sorry, Im kinda techno-challenged and didnt realize that I could post responses here! Both are drop safe. Why would they think this is a good idea? Basically, striker fired plastic fantastics are cocked and locked as well. Use the palm of your non-firing hand to pull the slide back and release it to chamber a round. Always do it that way. Not. arrow pointing to de-cocker: Click to expand. With normal firing grip, shooter is unable to reach decocking safety. Decockers most definitely allow you to have a heavier trigger pull, because you have the option not to decock it, thus having a lighter trigger pull. I have been told that may not be possible. The Dexx/Safety on your 3913 gives you an option of manual safety, if you want it. Not if those options are already made before your pistol is stowed. The average person carrying was not apt to be involved in a gun fight. Its a very safe system for police duty and concealed carry, because they offer a safeguard against negligent discharges without the ergonomic and training hamperings of a manual safety. Yep. They are a world of improvement over single action only/manual safety styles. There is more to carrying a gun than just shooting. Model G decock only. Be sure to remain people up-to-date similar to this. Sig Sauer P 226 X-Five Allround 9mm luger, is perfect for me, Im a southpaw. > DA on first round (Decocked!) Score 1. 1. That what the DS means. You are going to holster that? I dont listen to bombastic phonies. For some people its a great idea and a DA/SA gives them that option. Copyright 2022 Ammunition Depot, ALL RIGHTS RESERVED, Unleashing the Firepower of John Wick 4: The Top Featured Guns and Ammo, Florida Becomes the 26th State to Adopt Constitutional Carry, Gear Review: Rattlesnake Tactical Medium Range Bag, Gun Review: Springfield DS Prodigy - Part 2, How to Transfer Ownership of a Gun: State by State, Best of the Best, September 2022 Gun Giveaway (CONTEST ENDED). We know after the Polish Army adopted the Radom, FN assisted them with establishing a factory to produce it. I bought my First De-Cocker in a Walther P99 AS. document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); document.getElementById( "ak_js_3" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Unlock exclusive member content from our industry experts. How do you de-cock a pistol. Sigs at least (dunno about others) also is like a revolver in that the gun will not fire unless the trigger is all the way to the rear. This writer submits that both should be used. My conclusion is they dont work well for people with small hands or a weak grip. My Walther has been flawless Since day one. Decock (untilt) pistol and reholster. 1911 load one press safety up, Holster! Until you forget to decock after use, and prior to holstering (which most instructors on serious training ranges have seen more than once). When was the de-cocking lever invented and by whom? The decocker allows the hammer to be lowered without the firing pin safety being disengaged. Use a Decocking Mechanism when Available, B. Follow through is squeezing the trigger all the way back and holding it. anyone who cant drive a stick cant drive the gun. And now Ill ask you again for the list of professional trainers that endorse the carry of cocked and unlocked SA or DA/SA autopistols. Theyre like the people who call all semiauto pistols a Glock. Dont think. Nah, Ill just leave that one here. No offense but that was a really dumb thing to say. @ Big Mickey I agree. Comments (0) As I read the article, where the author claims that decocker levers have to be thumbed downward to activate and then thumbed back upwards to render the pistol active again, I thought to myself Whoa, that sounds unnecessarily complicated. The CZ decocker lets you thumb it to drop the hammer back into DA, and thats it. Love my Sigs with decocker. On the Beretta, the de-cocking lever doubles as a manual safety. Nam lacinia pulvinar tortor nec facilisis. Yes, I have to train to push another lever before I holster my gun. They dont work like they should. With two different trigger positions and two different trigger weights, de-cocker equipped pistols require training and practice to master. True. Obviously not the surplus cop pistol part, but first quality pistol impressions, like first loves, can stay with a person and color their opinions forever. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Yup. Whereas people that only shoot striker guns are a bit more challenged. Once we explain the ins-and-outs of de-cockers to students, we often field two sarcastic questions:Who came up with this? DA/SA semi-autos tend to have a heavier and more inconsistent pull, (not sure why, the rev olver has to do the extra work of rotating the cylinder with that trig ger stroke. Some of them make me afraid, very afraid. You can uncock pistols with hammers by holding the hammer and pressing the trigger then let the hammer back down slowly. Most of us use the terminology created half a century ago or more by Col. Jeff Cooper, the man some called the high priest of the 1911 .45, and refer to cocked and locked carry as Condition One.. The comments afterwards make me feel warm and fuzzy. Theyre only tough to master if you have excluded your gun use to plastic wunders. Second. With drop-safe construction such as Springfield Armory's, the cocked-and-locked 1911 is perfectly safe. Proper storage usually requires that the firing chamber be empty and. And yet thats EXACTLY how Glocks are designed to be carried, and ARE carried by the thousands of police and private owners. 1 hotdogfood 7 yr. ago "Once your finger is off the trigger" being the key part. The Walther manual is a little vague on several points, and says to just clear the chamber and pull the trigger. Unload all the guns before storing them away and load them when preparing for. Cooper never did this of course because he wasnt a colonel and he wasnt retired military. in your name went missing due to sheer negligence and got misused, be prepared to face severe consequences. Basically, striker fired plastic fantastics are cocked and locked as well its just you have less control over them. I have not tried that on my 1911s, probably should. Btw. the sig p22x decocker is a positive release you have control of the hammer through the decock lever the whole time . My best guess for the newfangled safety system: Wilniewczyc and Skrzypiski had patent issues to consider . . and does not stay down in an inoperable/safe mode. One Simple Trick for Keeping Your Guns Incredibly Clean, The Four Rules of Gun Safety for New Gun Ownersand Everyone Else [VIDEO], How to Make Sure Your Shotgun Really Fits You, https://eaacorp.com/index.php/guns/witness-elite-gold-team-tanfoglio-76, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYvAxLX6OzE, http://www.taurususa.com/product-details.cfm?id=169&category=Pistol. When the original concept of a DA re volver was invented a century and a half ago, the idea of mastering the long heavy tri gger pull was never envisioned. [URL=http://Excellentkeylogger.com/ keyloggers [/URL It is definitely not without its dangers and temptations. Or you dont have to use it at all. Enter in your email and password to create a FREE account. They will remain with us. Or Not. And you holster it that way. To decock a pistol safely and easily, [ you should: KEEP THE HANDGUN POINTED IN A SAFE DIRECTION; Enable the safety if available; Use the decocking lever if available; Place non-dominant hand thumb between hammer and firing pin. ] Now I have a Taurus Beretta 92 clone that has a frame mounted safety like a 1911. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. In fact, they create needless safety and training issues.. JER (Joint Ethics Regulations), para. 2. Each one if these pistols sre fine weapons for duty and self defense carry if and big IF the user is trained how to operate them. I would like to see more guns made with dexxxxer mechanisms, but realize SIG is not likely to allow use of their super-solution without a license fee, which hardly any other manufacturer would pay. Nam risus ante, dapibu, Explore over 16 million step-by-step answers from our library, molestie consequat, ultrices ac magna. And that applies to a lot of you 1911 shooters, too! Sure, its easy to remember how your pistol is configured right after youve dropped it into your holster. . I always carry hammer-down when concealed carrying. A glock doesnt allow you to do very much really except keep it in a cocked and unlocked state which is what a glock is a gun with a SA trigger pull and no external safety. 35 Vis is captioned as Beretta 92F, hammer down, trigger forward.. Nam lacinia pulvinar tortor nec facilisis. 1911 and HiPower used the single action/double action system whaaaaat? Although recent trends in the law enforcement and commercial markets have favored striker-fired semi-automatic pistols for home and holster, the more traditional double-action semi-auto retains a strong presence. Things get dropped in fights. Hello? discussions around Walther firearms including but not limited to the PPK, PPK/S, PP, P38, PPQ, PPS, P99, PPX, CCP, PK380, P22, G22, WA2000, VG, G43, G41, MP, CREED, and Q5 Match. But in the end theyre all just machines and you can learn how to use them if you can overcome your built in prejudices. Ha-ha! I do think there is a slightly greater learning curve with DA/SA, but its certainly not what the striker partisans make it out to be. Close. Similar to the first time I shot a semi auto shotgun and couldnt figure out how to pump it after I missed a clay. Im just content which you embraced this useful details around. In training with such pistols, the realities imposed by the decocker must be recognized and accommodated. Nam risus ante, dapibus a molestie consequat, ultrices ac magna. You have entered an incorrect email address! Transition to new platform was a cinch, jack round in chamber press lever down, holster, no safety! Provided of course the first shot was planned. I know what I have been shooting for 40 years and I dont like strikers. This type of technology to protect your marriage. Everything you wrote above also applies to Glocks and S&W M&P models. and the initials of the designers with the i being the Poilish word for and. Bend over the crossbow, grabbing the bowstring on both sides of the barrel using all four fingers of both hands. You know so much its almost hard to argue with you (not that I actually would want to. Any advice on safety would be greatly appreciated. On most designs, leaving the lever engaged results in a dead (i.e., non-functional) trigger. That was when I wore a pistol bag and before I went to a belt holster. Oh the irony. Pellentesque dapibus efficitur laoreet. The truth is, heavier trigger pulls are only a big deal if you agonize over them. or an instructor who has seen the various problems with effective use of these pistols in actual use. Even if he had made the rank he wasnt entitled to use it since he did not retire but was drummed out. Most of the work at hand. Your choice. If youre ever having this discussion with someone and they say smugly, It doesnt matter, cause Ill never drop my gun, try not to laugh in their face. All one has to do if practice the DA for that first round, then its down hill while in SA mode. I much prefer it to using a manual safety, which can easily be forgotten.. Come back and talk to me after youve spent 2-3 decades training folks how to use pistols, especially DA/SA autopistols with decockers. If someone were to make your argument with regards to the Second Amendment, youd have your panties in a bunch. I will agree you need to remember to flip the safety lever/de-cocker back to fire if it does double dutype as a safety. Is there a reason the hammer cant be cocked manually for the first shot? if one uses the two handed technique, where one uses the other hand to block access to the firing pin while thumbing down the hammer. What led me to DA/SA pistols was a post I read that was written by a retired NYPD police officer. User: To decock a pistal safely and easily you should safely unload the pistal then utilize the . A DA/SA pistol does allow a heavier trigger pull on the first shot and some people want that. They offer no tangible safety benefit. You can unsubscribe at any time by replying STOP or clicking I agree with most comments, a double-action trigger gives hammer-fired pistols an added level of safety. We asked for, and discussed various mechanisms, and my primary goal was always the safest operation. I guess it worked on me though oh Weill homo!!! That was comforting. Carrying in this manner virtually eliminates stress induced, safety related mistakes. Most da/sa guns have a trigger/hammer block safety (which means the trigger must be pulled back and depressed to align the hammer to the firing pin) similar in function to the glocks trigger safety. It is carried to defend against unexpected attack. Consent is not a condition of any purchase. Decades of (self) training left me with a revolver where I fired a couple shots (normally SA because it is FUN!) This is about as much crap as the primer crap above. So its a ViS not Vis, but ViS (a play on the Latin word for strength (?) If you carry cocked and unlocked (I.e. Pick one, train and practice with it until you can use it safely and proficiently. Interesting attitude! Massad Ayoob is a renowned firearms expert with decades of experience in the firearms community. Consistency. Well I had one Years ago & did not even realize it was anything but a Safety lever. If you train and your muscle memory is set up for flicking off a safety first, then that is fine too. Always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction. Check the USPSA/IDPA results, see how many DA/SA pistols (again, fired in that manner, not a CZ starting from cocked-and-locked) finish at/near the top of the competitions where they run head-to-head with striker guns and other competing designs. For example, a Beretta model 96G (decock only) looks almost exactly like a model 96FS (decocking safety) and it takes more than a casual examination to note the huge difference between the two. plus it rolls the firering mechanism out of line so no chance of it firing while decocking. So how could all these 19th century and early 20th century people carry guns with a round in the chamber or a round under the hammer in the case of a revolver and not have all sorts of accidental discharges? Pretty broad comment. What a joke, you have no business teaching anyone about firearms. Whether it's your 9mm SD VE or an M&P 380 Shield, very often, new gun owners get irresponsible with their brand-new handguns. Fire. When worn, They would often fire even if the safety was engaged (Savage 32 was known for this). It didnt fall out and the hammer was covered protecting it. I have a Bersa Firestorm .380 which has a de-cocker. I have a Walther P99 AS with De-Cocker, which was the first I heard of the Device. The Decocker gives you more options. Place a weak hand finger or thumb in front of the cocked hammer, wedging it between the hammer face and the frame of the gun. The photo of the wz. Im a fan of this style gun. I love opinion pieces.
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